I turned off the motor to move the rails by hand. The right rail is definitely making clicking sounds as the x-rail slides back-and-forth across it. Are there ball bearings between X and Y rails? And any tips on getting to that before I bite the bullet and start disassembling?
Edit: I found photos further up and they do indeed have ball bearings.
There are the usual standard bearings in the tooth belt rolls, but AFAIK that’s it.
If you get clicking sounds when moving the rails there definitely is a very significant lack of grease in the linear guides (not enough to let the roller balls “stick” at their place).
Sooner or later, such a lack of grease will cause the roller balls in the linear guides to jam since - in opposite to a normal ball bearing - the balls are not guided by a cage but slide against each other. If they jam, you have a good chance the bearing will get dents either in the balls or in the contact surfaces of slide or rail. Think of a straight row of marbles where you push the last one to move them all forward. If they all run free, everything is fine, but if there is even a slight blockage in the way of the first one, they will do anything but stay in a row.
This is what I suspect has happened in your case. The only way to circumvent this is to grease the guide - regularly (whenever there is the slightest noise - out of experience I can say these intervals increase over time even with guides that are not manufactured well, such as the black ones Snapmaker used first) and in accordance to what the linear guide manufacturers say, i.e. not by doing it as Snapmaker says.
I bit the bullet then spent an entire afternoon disassembling the X and Y rails then lubing all the bearings. After taking the Y rails apart I noticed some brown residue, possibly rust. Aside from that didn’t notice any visible damage. Cleaned everything as best as I can then put everything back together. Not my idea of a good time but the clicking went away for now.
This thing is really half-baked lol. Good idea, bad execution.
If I remember correctly and do not mix up your forum name, you have your printer for some time now as well. Assuming that, I fear you cannot make Snapmaker responsible for not doing maintenance (for the quality of their maintenance instructions you can blame them though - a “you must grease before first use” notice, some grease syringes supplied and a proper instruction how to do this would have saved them a lot of unsatisfied customers…).
Any kind of metal bearing or linear guide requires regular greasing. And your printer has already the new green linear guides which were properly greased when the printer was shipped.
If you regrease in regular intervals, you do not need to take the printer apart, just get a syringe and a fitting needle as pointed out here in the forum and grease through the hole that the manufacturer of the linear guide has made for that purpose. And you should do that ASAP with the other two linear guides since the grease should be more or less dead there as well.
I am a little puzzled though about the rust. This can either come from fretting corrosion between the slider balls (which would mean you did use the printer for a really long time without proper grease and are very lucky the linear guide is still functional at all, even if I suspect its precision may have suffered somewhat) or you have or had a moistuire issue somewhere.
Yes some official instruction would be great instead of having users dig through the forums to find these essential information.
When I first received the printer I found little to no grease on the rails even though as you said it’s the green one with proper greasing. I slapped some extra PTFE grease on the rails and called it a day. But the grease did not make it into the bearings so those were running dry. I’m afraid I haven’t found a good way to apply grease to the bearings themselves other than to take the thing apart.
I do feel lucky it still works, but it shouldn’t have to be this way. My other printer is a Dremel 3D45 which ran just fine maintenance-free for 5 years. That thing was built like a tank.
Well, it all depends on the parts used, which is a tradeoff between speed, precision and maintenance
In the case if the J1, you have a rather heavy IDEX head that shall move fast - the only way to achieve this are linear guides which you have to take more care of (at least if you stick with standard parts).
And never use grease with solid particles in linear bearings!! No MoS2, no PTFE, no graphite! That stuff will increase the risk of stuck balls in the slides massively!
Hi there, I suppose it’s not rust. The snap maker Wiki says that one has to do maintenance ‘Every three months or when the lubricating grease color turns black brown’. I suppose that’s it.
What about the green parts. My machine does not have that modification. Please help me out and point me to the correct post!
The bit about PTFE is confusing. What I have on hand is Super Lube 92003 which is NGLI2 and designed for stuff like this. Raise3D for example specifically recommends this grease for lubricating their E2’s rods and linear rails. I’ll wait and see how well this works.
Okay, I just repeated what several linear rail manufacturers state. If the grease you use is explicitly made for this type of guides, then you are fine. But it makes sense to note this - otherwise some clueless reader here might use whatever PTFE grease he has at hand 
@Albert The grease usually does not turn that brown by itself - it collects the tiny steel chips that are rubbed off the rails when they run in - and depending on moisture and amount these turn to rust and create the colour.
Regarding the green rails: Snapmaker replaced the No-Name rails they used first with green SHAC linear rails after enough issues were reported here. I believe i3sven was the first to note that here - no official statement was made by Snapmaker to announce that though. The black ones are fine however, provided they are properly greased as soon as possible after unpacking the printer since there seems to have been quite an amount of those that did not see a single drop of grease in the factory (mine was among those, hence the note in the “things to do first with a J1” topic I created back then.
Hello everyone,
since I haven’t done any prints for a while, more precisely no larger ones over 4 hours, I haven’t been active here.
Yesterday, however, I started a decent print again, 22 hours of printing time.
Now I actually have my old problem again, beating noises!
It occurs again at approx. 86% print advance, so it’s been a really long time without any problems.
It really looks like something is wrong with the X and Y movement.
Since it takes so long for this to happen, it can only be the circuit board, I’m almost 100% sure.
Nothing has changed at all, neither temperature nor speed, it’s like it’s jinxed.
German:
Hallo zusammen,
da ich eine Weile, keine Drucke gemacht habe, genauer gesagt keine größeren über 4 Stunden, war ich eine hier nicht aktiv.
Gestern habe ich aber wieder einen ganz ordentlichen Druck gestartet, 22 Stunden Druckzeit.
Jetzt habe ich doch tatsächlich wieder mein altes Problem, Schlaggeräusche!
Bei ca. 86 % Druckvorschritt tritt es wieder auf, also echt lange ohne Probleme.
Es sieht echt so aus, als würde etwas beim Regeln der X und Y Bewegung nicht passen.
Da es so lange dauert, bis das passiert, kann es nur noch die Platine sein, ich bin mir fast 100 % sicher.
Es hat sich überhaupt nichts geändert, weder Temperatur noch Geschwindigkeit, wie verhext.
I had a similar problem, I reduced the flow rate and then it was quiet.
German:
So ähnlich hatte ich es auch, habe den Flussrate runter genommen dann war Ruhe.
No, sorry, but I’ve already been through all that…
Watch the video to see exactly when this happens…
I’ve been struggling with this for a year now
Ne, sorry, aber das habe ich alles schon hinter mir…
Sieh mal genau im Video, wann das passiert…
Ich quäle mich schon seit einem Jahr damit herum
Sounds like it comes from the Y-axis.
German:
Hört sich an, wie wenn es von der Y-Achse kommt.
Yes, I agree…
But you hear it much more strongly in connection with Y.
Anyone standing next to it thinks the box is bumping into something, but that’s not the case - I’ve had plenty of time to find out so far.
It can only come from the circuit board.
The crazy thing is that it only happens when the pressure lasts a very long time and the X-Y axes interact with each other.
German:
Ja, das sehe ich auch so…
Aber in Verbindung mit Y viel stärker zu hören.
Wer daneben steht, denkt, die Kiste stößt irgendwo an, das ist aber nicht so, hatte bisher ja viel Zeit, es herauszufinden.
Es kann nur noch von der Platine kommen.
Das Verrückte ist ja, das es nur passiert, wenn der Druck sehr lange dauert und die X-Y Achsen miteinander agieren.
2.0 user here so maybe no real help.
For me it seems to come from the Y axis. - Maybe your setscrew became loose?
https://wiki.snapmaker.com/snapmaker_j1/troubleshooting/Y-sensor-failure
Ger: Ich denke vielleicht ist die Kupplung der Y-Achse etwas locker sodass sich ein Rutschen und ggf. Verwinden in X ergibt?
That would be too easy, I’ve already done the number.
There’s nothing mechanical that I haven’t already checked, I’ve already had a year to do that.
Everything is correct, tight and parallel.
The thing is that it only occurs after several hours.
German:
Das wäre zu einfach, die Nummer habe ich schon durch.
Es gibt nicht mechanisches, was ich nicht schon überprüft hätte, dafür hatte ich ja bereits 1 Jahr Zeit.
Es ist alles korrekt, fest und Parallel.
Das Ding ist, dass es auch immer erst nach etlichen Stunden auftritt.
Hi everyone,
I’ve been using a replacement board since yesterday and have been “printing” since yesterday morning without any impact noises.
I’m not really printing, because the test is running without filament, but the test file is the same as last time, with the noises.
What I have noticed, however, is that when I select the “Fast” option in the “Performance settings”, I have different noises again, but this time like a grinding noise.
Quite strange, the “grinding noise” always comes from the currently active motor, which sounds as if the control is causing a special frequency, which then sounds like grinding.
@everione
Can any of you confirm this?
Explanation from @Mechanikus Thanks for that!
However, this is not because something is grinding, but rather because the J1 then switches its stepper motor drivers to a different operating mode. Instead of “StealthChop”, the stepper is then controlled with “SpreadCycle”. This mode has slightly more torque, but is considerably louder. I can also adjust this with the Duet if I set the same motor timings as Snapmaker.
The “grinding” noise comes from the higher vibration frequencies of the motors, which are generated by the different shape of the current curve and are very clearly audible through the cast aluminum axle carriers of the J1.
StealthChop was developed by TMC precisely to minimize this noise.
Print speed 105 mm/s
German:
Moin zusammen,
seit gestern habe ich eine Ersatzplatine im Einsatz und »Drucke« seit gestern Früh bis jetzt ohne Schlaggeräusche.
Ich drucke nicht wirklich, denn der Test läuft ohne Filament, aber Testdatei ist die gleiche wie beim Letzten mal, mit den Geräuschen.
Was mir aber aufgefallen ist, wenn ich in den »Performanz-Einstellungen« die Option »Fast« auswähle, habe ich schon wieder andere Geräusche, dieses Mal aber wie ein Schleifen.
Ganz eigenartig, das »Schleifgeräusch« kommt immer vom gerade aktiven Motor, das klingt, als würde die Ansteuerung eine besondere Frequenz verursachen, was dann wie ein Schleifen klingt.
@everione
Kann das jemand von euch bestätigen?
Erklärung von @Mechanikus Danke dafür!
Das liegt aber nicht daran, daß etwas schleift, sondern vielmehr daran, daß der J1 dann seine Schrittmotortreiber in einen anderen Betriebsmodus schaltet. Statt mit “StealthChop” wird der Stepper dann mit “SpreadCycle” angesteuert. Dieser Modus hat etwas mehr Drehmoment, ist aber ganz erheblich lauter. Das kann ich mit der Duet auch nachstellen, wenn ich dieselben Motortimings wie Snapmaker festlege.
Das “schleifende” Geräusch kommt dabei von höheren Vibrationsfrequenzen der Motoren, die durch die andere Form der Stromverlaufskurve erzeugt und durch die Alugußachsträger des J1 sehr deutlich hörbar werden.
StealthChop wurde von TMC genau deswegen entwickelt, um diesen Lärm zu minimieren.
Druckgeschwindigkeit 105 mm/s
Update.
My test has been running for more than 18 hours now and it is beating again.
The beating noises are identical to the replaced circuit board.
Now I only have one option left, replacing the motor, I’ve already done everything else.
So it’s back to the support team.
German:
Update.
Seit nun mehr als 18 Stunden läuft mein Test und es schlägt wieder.
Die Schlaggeräusche sind mit der ausgetauschten Platine identisch.
Jetzt habe ich nur noch eine Option, Motorentausch, alles andere habe ich ja bereits durch.
Also ist der Support wieder an der Reihe.
Hello @everyone,
Since my test is making the same noises again, despite the different circuit board, I have a request.
Before I replace any more parts, I would like to ask someone here to run my test file in one of your devices.
—Test conditions—
You don’t need filament, please switch off the filament detection.
I have limited the print temperature to 40 °C so that fans do not run unnecessarily.
The print bed temperature is 90 °C to 100 °C, so that the print chamber has the same temperature as mine.
The printer housing must be closed and no ventilation must be switched on!
The total printing time is 18 hours and 23 minutes calculated via Luban.
Please someone carry out this test, this is the only way we can really make progress.
If someone wants the electricity costs back, I’ll pay for it!
This is the only way I can really find out what is wrong with my J1, I simply have no other options.
Thank you for your support.
Best regards
German:
Hallo zusammen,
da mein Test, trotz der anderen Platine, schon wieder die gleichen Geräusche macht, habe ich eine Bitte.
Bevor ich jetzt noch mehr Teile austausche, bitte ich hier jemanden meine Test-Datei in einem eurer Geräte laufen zu lassen.
—Testbedingungen—
Ihr benötigt kein Filament, bitte schaltet die Filament-Erkennung dafür aus.
Ich habe die Drucktemperatur auf 40 °C begrenzt, damit nicht unnötig Lüfter laufen.
Die Druckbetttemperatur beträgt 90 °C bis 100 °C, damit der Druckraum die gleiche Temperatur bekommt wie bei mir.
Das Druckergehäuse muss geschlossen sein und keine Belüftung einschalten!
Die gesamte Druckdauer beträgt 18h und 23 Min. via Luban gerechnet.
Bitte führt jemand diesen Test durch, nur so kommen wir wirklich weiter.
Wenn jemand dafür die Stromkosten wiederhaben will, zahle ich das!
Nur so kann ich wirklich herausfinden, was mit meinem J1 los ist, ich habe einfach keine anderen Optionen mehr.
Danke für eure Unterstützung.
Beste Grüße
@i3sven What about the motors. Maybe one of them isn’t fully constrained… Did you try tightening all the mountingscrews for the motors?
Maybe Snapmaker could replace your printer with a new one. You shouldn’t have to go through all this trouble in my opinion. Did you ask them about this?
