Anything needed for bed adhesion on the J1?

Snapmaker J1/J1s
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Out of curiosity: do you use any “glue” (hair spray / Printafix / 3Dlac / Magigoo / you-name-it) for printing - or is the PEI surface good enough for everything usual (PLA, PETG, TPU, most probably PVA or BVOH), provided it gets to see some IPA on a regular basis to remove grease and such?

I am coming from years of printing only onto a plain glass plate - and I used first a simple glue stick and then switched to Printafix, mainly to keep PETG tearing off bits from the glass but out of sheer lazyness for most PLA and TPU prints as well.
Therefore I have a certain lack of personal experience with “modern” build surfaces… but I want to have everything at hand when the transport from China :auto_rickshaw: finally arrives and I get my J1 :crazy_face:

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scroll for english

German:
Hi @Mechanikus,

ich persönlich bin sehr zufrieden mit der Haftung.
Ich habe bisher TPU, PLA und PETG, nur auf der Rauen-Oberfläche gedruckt, ohne Haftvermittler.
Keinerlei Probleme, musst halt nur warten, bis die Glasplatte abgekühlt ist, um die Modelle dann abzubekommen.
Sobald das Material das ist, was ich noch brauche, drucke ich dann PA-CF und PVA, mal sehen wie das funktioniert, werde dann berichten.
Das wird aber ohne Haftvermittler nicht klappen.

Edit:
Ganz wichtig, es muss bei der Kalibrierung schon darauf geachtet werden, dass beide Düsenabstände mittig eingestellt werden, also mittig im Grünen Okay Sektor!
Denn zum Beispiel, wer nur gerade so, im Grünen Sektor ist, also angenommen, Linke Düse Links im Grünen und Rechte Düse Rechts im Grünen, ist die ganze Nummer schon versaut.
Dann muss man sich nicht wundern, dass die Haftung einer Seite gut ist und die andere nicht hält.
Meine Kalibrierung ist exakt mittig und habe überhaupt keine Probleme, auch nicht mit dem weißen PLA von Snapmaker.
Ich habe hier schon gelesen das es Probleme gibt, aber das kann nur an unkorrekter Kalibrierung liegen.
Die Option Mensch ist bei einer Teilautomatischen Kalibrierung immer noch entscheidend!

English:

Hi @Mechanikus,

I am personally very satisfied with the adhesion.
So far I’ve only printed TPU, PLA and PETG on the rough surface, without adhesion promoter.
No problems at all, you just have to wait until the glass plate has cooled down to get the models off.
As soon as the material is what I need, I’ll print PA-CF and PVA, let’s see how it works, will report back.
But that won’t work without an adhesion promoter.

Edit:
Very important, during the calibration it must be ensured that both nozzle distances are set in the middle, i.e. in the middle of the green okay sector!
Because, for example, if you are just in the green sector, i.e. left nozzle left in the green and right nozzle right in the green, the whole number is already messed up.
Then you don’t have to be surprised that the adhesion of one side is good and the other doesn’t hold.
My calibration is right in the middle and I have no problems at all, even with Snapmaker’s white PLA.
I have read here that there are problems, but that can only be due to incorrect calibration.
The human option is still decisive in semi-automatic calibration!

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@i3sven Danke! Seit heute kann ich auch anfangen selber zu probieren. :smiley:

Ein Hinweis an alle wartenden Käufer: die Mitteilung auf der Snapmaker-Versandseite scheint sich nach dem ersten Eintrag nicht zu aktualisieren. Wenn Ihr wissen wollt, wo Euer Paket ist, guckt direkt bei UPS oder einem Trackingdienst nach.

@i3sven Thanks a lot! As of today, I can also start trying for myself :smiley:

A note to all waiting buyers: the message on the Snapmaker shipping page doesn’t seem to update after the first entry. If you want to know where your package is, check directly with UPS or a tracking service.

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I think adhesion on the textured side is poor. I have been ‘solving’ the problem with magigoo.

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I hate printing on glass, but with 3DLAC the adheison is great!

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The PEI surface is insanely good for every material ive tried. As soon as the build plate cools to room temperature, you can take your prints off as if there was never any adhesion.

The temperature needs to be a little on the high end with PLA and id reccomend setting the initial line width to be a little thicker. I use a 0.6mm line width on a 0.4mm nozzle at a layer height of 0.2 for my first layers.

PETG has not given me any issues, i too was nervous about PETG with the glass plate.

IPA works great to clean the build plate, the included scraper does a good job of getting skirts and purge lines off the plate. Alternatively, you can flip the plate to the smooth side and use VisionMiner Nano Polymer Adhesive for all plastics except PP and Delrin.

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Thanks for all the input! With my few tests until now (I am mostly concentrating on getting the hotend more reliable and updating the Cura profile so far…) I found the textured side surprisingly good, even if it seems it does need some run-in-cycles. I did use my own settings there however - higher layer thickness for the first layer (0,2 instead of 0.15), combined with am almost doubled extrusion rate.

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I have changed my mind, as long as the bed is clean it sticks well. I have found the best way to clean it is with warm water, a sponge, and dish soap!

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I added a Lokbuild on the PEI. Works great with all kind of Filament. Bed Temp PLA is 50 and all work fine.
No Glue or Lac needed, i dont like that sjit in my printers. PVA is no Problem too.
The only thing u need is a High Quality Industial Buildplate Surface. In My Job we have Big Industrial Printers for Prototyping or Spareparts and we dont Print on Glass directly. So i tried this for me at home too and works great.

IMG_20230301_205900
IMG_20230301_2059001920×1080 107 KB

IMG_20230301_205848
IMG_20230301_2058481920×1080 114 KB

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Thanks for the hint! That seems to be some serious print surface - any complaints I found were about people not being able to remove their printed stuff anymore :smile:

How did you do the leveling? Just standard and then a little manual correction I guess? Or did you buy some thinner glass plate?

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I use original plate.
After the leveling is correct I remove the plate and put the lokbuild on it. I measure the thickness note it on paper.

Now I start a calibration print.
Press on adjust if the print start and add the lokbuild thickness to the z offset

First layer Extrusion 100
First layer thickness 0.22
Bed temp 50

No problems to remove the stuff from the plate.
If you start with that settings on Pla I think it will work fine.
Sure you need to do fine tune the settings but this are a good start. I do it by my self at this.

So you can print the first layer with speed between 30 and 50. Depends on your used material

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But you can use thinner glass to, that will be a nice idea too

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Just as a note for the users who have adhesion issues with the original build plate: a thorough brush (literally, wiping with a cloth won’t get into the deeper areas) with a good kitchen grease remover works wonders!

For the german users: I used “Bref Power” - no clue if you can get that stuff outside germany though.

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Just another update: my cleaning procedure seems to work even a little too well. With a freshly cleaned plate, I printed a PETG part with PLA supports - and some of the PEI coating decided to prefer the PETG over the glass plate!

So, be careful with that stuff.

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That’s the reason why I use buildtak or lokbuild.
LoL

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Yes, but I want to avoid that :slight_smile:

BuildTak does not seem to survive high temperatures, and Lokbuild seems to have the same problem as my J1 build plate had - it sticks too well sometimes. Apart from that, a sheet of that stuff is just as expensive as one of the Snapmaker plates. :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

Since I now have a build plate I can happily experiment with, I’ll try my luck with a layer of good ol’ 3DLac first. Hair spray might work as well if you find the right one, I guess.

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I use the lokbuild for all kinds of Filament. Very happy with them and no problems

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I just got a J1 and I print a lot with ASA on my Ender 3 with a bendable metal plate. Has anybody has experience with adhesion of that material? Thanks.

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Think that should work too. Why not. I use general Lokbuild for all kind of materials.

But will be good to know that your choice work too. Want upgrade some metal magnetic sheet too

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Clean the PEI glass plate and get the z offset right for the ASA. If you set the bed temp just right, parts will come off without any issues when the plate cools down. if the temp is too high at the start, it will be very difficult to get parts off. For the Material specific Gcode in Prusa and SuperSlicer, use the M206 command to set Z offset per material. This solved my issue with having to change z offset on the printer every time i switched materials.

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